Legislature(1993 - 1994)
03/30/1993 05:00 PM House TRA
| Audio | Topic |
|---|
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HOUSE TRANSPORTATION STANDING COMMITTEE
March 30, 1993
5:00 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Richard Foster, Chair
Representative Gary Davis, Vice-Chair
Representative Eldon Mulder
Representative Al Vezey
Representative Curt Menard
Representative Jerry Mackie
MEMBERS ABSENT
Representative Bill Hudson
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
*HB 243: "An Act requiring a licensed pilot for a tug boat
used with an oil barge on a river in a pilotage
region."
HEARD AND MOVED INTO SUBCOMMITTEE
HB 182: "An Act making a special appropriation to the
Department of Transportation and Public
Facilities, Northern Region, for identification
and delineation of a transportation and utility
corridor between Fairbanks and the Seward
Peninsula; and providing for an effective date."
MOVED FROM COMMITTEE WITH INDIVIDUAL
RECOMMENDATIONS
HB 183: "An Act directing the identification and
delineation of a transportation and utility
corridor between Fairbanks and the Seward
Peninsula for road, rail, pipeline, and electrical
transmission purposes; and providing for an
effective date."
MOVED FROM COMMITTEE WITH INDIVIDUAL
RECOMMENDATIONS
(* First public hearing.)
WITNESS REGISTER
REPRESENTATIVE JERRY SANDERS
Alaska State Legislature
State Capitol
Juneau, Alaska 99801
465-4945
Position Statement: Sponsor of HB 243.
MICHAEL HAGLUND, Admiralty Counsel
Kuskokwim Pilots Association
Haglund and Kirtley
1247-6th Avenue
Portland, Oregon
(503) 225-0777
Position Statement: Provided testimony in favor of HB 243.
CAPTAIN RON SUMSTAD
General Delivery
Bethel, Alaska 99559
224-3349
Position Statement: Provided testimony in favor of HB 243,
answered questions on HB 243.
MIKE TAGLIAZENTO
Delta Western
510 L Street, Suite 306
Anchorage, Alaska 99501
276-2688
Position Statement: Provided testimony against HB 243.
(Spoke via teleconference)
LOUIS AUDETTE
49ER Transportation Co.
1600 A Street, Suite 308
Anchorage, Alaska 99501
279-5878
Position Statement: Provided testimony against HB 243.
(Spoke via teleconference)
ART JACOBSEN
Crowley Marine Services
P.O. Box 2287
Seattle, Washington 98111
(206)340-2938
Position Statement: Provided testimony against HB 243.
(Spoke via teleconference)
BRYCE EDGMON
Legislative Assistant
Senator George Jacko
Alaska State Senate
State Capitol
Juneau, Alaska 99801
465-4942
Position Statement: Provided testimony on behalf of Senator
Jacko opposing HB 243.
BOB HERRON
Legislative Assistant
Representative Lyman Hoffman
Alaska State Legislature
State Capitol
Juneau, Alaska 99801
465-4453
Position Statement: Provided testimony on behalf of Senator
Hoffman opposing HB 243.
RAY GILLESPIE
Gillespie & Associates
9478 Riverbend Court
Juneau, Alaska 99801
463-3375
Position Statement: Provided testimony opposing HB 243.
REPRESENTATIVE JEANNETTE JAMES
Alaska State Legislature
State Capitol
Juneau, Alaska 99801
456-3743
Position Statement: Sponsor of HB 182 and HB 183.
M. CLYDE STOLTZFUS, Chief
Office of Strategic Mgmt., Planning & Policy
Commissioner's Office
Alaska Department of Transportation and Public Facilities
3132 Channel Drive
Juneau, Alaska 99801
465-3000
Position Statement: Available to answer questions regarding
HB 182 and HB 183 that relate to the
DOT/PF.
PREVIOUS ACTION
BILL: HB 243
SHORT TITLE: PILOTS ON CERTAIN TUGS ON STATE WATERS
BILL VERSION:
SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) SANDERS
TITLE: "An Act requiring a licensed pilot for a tug boat
used with an oil barge on a river in a pilotage region."
JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION
03/19/93 709 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S)
03/19/93 709 (H) TRANSPORTATION
03/30/93 (H) TRA AT 05:00 PM CAPITOL 17
BILL: HB 182
SHORT TITLE: APPROP: FAIRBANKS-NOME TRANS. CORRIDOR
BILL VERSION:
SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) JAMES
TITLE: "An Act making a special appropriation to the
Department of Transportation and Public Facilities, northern
region, for identification and delineation of a
transportation and utility corridor between Fairbanks and
the Seward Peninsula; and providing for an effective date."
JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION
02/25/93 456 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S)
02/25/93 456 (H) TRANSPORTATION,RESOURCES,FINANCE
03/18/93 (H) TRA AT 05:00 PM CAPITOL 17
03/30/93 (H) TRA AT 05:00 PM CAPITOL 17
BILL: HB 183
SHORT TITLE: TRANSPORTATION CORRIDOR: FAIRBANKS-NOME
BILL VERSION:
SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) JAMES
TITLE: "An Act directing the identification and delineation
of a transportation and utility corridor between Fairbanks
and the Seward Peninsula for road, rail pipeline, and
electrical transmission purposes; and providing for an
effective date."
JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION
02/25/93 456 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S)
02/25/93 456 (H) TRANSPORTATION,RESOURCES,FINANCE
03/18/93 (H) TRA AT 05:00 PM CAPITOL 17
03/30/93 (H) TRA AT 05:00 PM CAPITOL 17
ACTION NARRATIVE
TAPE 93-12, SIDE A
Number 016
CHAIR FOSTER brought the meeting to order at 5:10 p.m.
HB 243 - PILOTS ON CERTAIN TUGS ON STATE WATERS
REPRESENTATIVE JERRY SANDERS gave his sponsor statement for
HB 243, and said HB 243 seeks to allow licensed marine
pilots to further serve the citizens of Alaska by assisting
in protecting our rivers and deltas, which was why the
marine pilots were first created. He stated that HB 243
addresses the issue of safety, which must be addressed
through preventive measures. Oil barges carrying 15,000
barrels or greater would be required to be assisted by
tugboats which shall employ state licensed pilots. State
licensed marine pilots are charged with keeping the
interests of Alaska concerning safety, opposed to profit,
and their primary responsibilities are not to the owner of
the ship or the owner's economic interests, but to the
state. State licensed marine pilots are familiar with the
rivers they've become familiar with through time. He noted
HB 243 mandates that the tug company could keep its own
pilots at the wheel, as long as the state licensed marine
pilot was present on the bridge.
Number 100
REPRESENTATIVE VEZEY asked Representative Sanders what was
the purpose of the bill, and commented that he felt the
legislation wasn't necessary.
Number 128
REPRESENTATIVE SANDERS responded that the main purpose was
to prevent oil spills.
REPRESENTATIVE VEZEY replied that he felt the financial
responsibilities on companies would be too great.
Number 269
MICHAEL E. HAGLUND, ADMIRALTY COUNSEL FOR KUSKOKWIM PILOTS
ASSOCIATION, discussed pilotage on the Kuskokwim River as
unique and unprecedented. He said that unlike other major
rivers, the Kuskokwim was primitive in terms of its
navigational infrastructure. He said there was no dredged
channel with no government issued charts or lights. He said
that despite difficult passage, the Kuskokwim River had been
open for commerce through the dedicated service of Sumstad
Navigation over the last four decades. Captain Ron Sumstad
and his Uncle Ole before him have provided pilotage service
to three to six ships and 15-25 oil and freight barges each
year since the 1950's.
MR. HAGLUND felt that fish and waterfowl protection were
answers as to why the Kuskokwim River should require
compulsory pilotage for all vessels with dangerous cargoes.
He felt that the two key reasons for requiring state-
licensed pilots for oil barges on the Kuskokwim were for
environmental protection and a license that ensures adequate
local knowledge.
MR. HAGLUND said, historically, barges are a significant
part of oil spills. He felt that the single biggest threat
to the marine environment on the Kuskokwim River was the
barge traffic. He mentioned a case in Washington where a
250,000 gallon spill in 1988 caused Washington's biggest oil
spill, causing damage to the north coast of Washington and
Vancouver Island in British Columbia.
Number 340
MR. HAGLUND also stated that the only license that
guarantees a requisite of level of local knowledge to pilot
oil tank barges into the Kuskokwim River was one that was
issued by the state to the historic pilots on this waterway.
He felt that without state regulation, there would be only
the promise of the industry's voluntary use of Capt. Sumstad
and his colleagues. He felt that without passage of HB 143,
there was nothing to prevent a tug and barge company from
using one of their own masters or mates who meets the
following minimal criteria: 12 round trips over the route
and six month's experience in the deck department on towing
vessels. Alaska's licensing requirements for the Kuskokwim
are three years as a trainee pilot on the river; 15 round
trips during the two years prior to licensure plus
supervised dockings; and a minimum of 15 trips in any one
year to renew the license for the following year.
Number 385
REPRESENTATIVE MACKIE asked Captain Haglund how many pilots
this legislation would currently apply to.
MR. HAGLUND replied that three would currently meet the
requirements.
Number 469
REPRESENTATIVE MULDER brought up the question of preemption
within HB 243 and requested that Captain Haglund respond.
MR. HAGLUND said that prior to 1990, there was a good
argument that states were prohibited from imposing
additional regulatory requirements on the coastwise oil
trade. With the passage of the Oil Pollution Act of 1990,
Congress explicitly authorized states to enact their own
statutes and regulations to prevent oil spills on state
waters and to impose liability for those spills. He noted
that OPA 90 at 33 U.S.C. S 2718(a) expressly allows states
to impose more restrictive regulations than those contained
in federal law. The bill proposes to extend compulsory
state pilotage to include large oil barges. He stated that
no case had been decided at this time that would provide for
a legal precedent for legal challenge.
Number 522
REPRESENTATIVE MULDER again stated his concerns that this
requirement contained in HB 243 could then be brought forth
for legal challenge.
Number 525
CAPTAIN HAGLUND replied he felt it was unlikely a challenge
would be brought forward.
Number 536
MIKE TAGLIAZENTO, representing DELTA WESTERN, addressed his
concerns regarding HB 243 to the committee. He stated that
as a Western Alaska fuel distributor, Delta Western is a
major operator and charterer of tug and barges that navigate
the Western Alaska river systems. He said he did not
understand the rationalism for the legislation and said that
their company had operated safely in the Western river
region since 1983. All their tug personnel are well trained
in seamanship and are well versed in local knowledge of the
rivers on which they operate. During their ten years of
operation, they had compiled a strong safety record and have
had no major spills. He went on to add that vessels
utilized in the Western rivers are unique equipment,
specially designed for operating with the extreme shallow
drafts located in these rivers. Pilotage requirements and
operating experience for this type of vessel are different
from pilotage requirements for deeper draft vessels, such as
those in Southeast Alaska, Cook Inlet or Dutch Harbor areas.
MR. TAGLIAZENTO stated his concerns regarding the costs
associated to HB 243. He said his company and management
are familiar with pilotage rules, regulations and the
increased operating costs that accompany such rules.
Operating costs on the Western Alaska rivers are already
extremely high due to the specialized nature of the
equipment in which to deliver a year's supply of fuel. This
legislation will only add to the economic burden of
operating in remote areas of Alaska.
Number 580
REPRESENTATIVE VEZEY asked Mr. Tagliazento how many trips
they would use pilotage service.
MR. TAGLIAZENTO replied approximately three trips each
summer.
Number 613
LOUIS AUDETTE, representing 49ER TRANSPORTATION, said he was
opposed to HB 243 for several reasons. Foremost, he would
not want to relinquish command of his vessels to a pilot who
may not have any tugboat experience. A barge "on the hip"
responds much differently than a ship where rudders and
propulsion are located on the center line. Every tug and
barge unit has its own handling characteristics; and a
pilot, with or without experience, cannot gain knowledge of
those idiosyncrasies in the short time he is on board. He
mentioned the increased costs incurred by someone not
familiar with the vessel. He was concerned that this bill
would set a precedent for other areas of the state to
require pilots for smaller tank barges. He felt it should
be noted that pilots are used with local knowledge to guide,
not take command of, their vessels when it is prudent. He
took strong exception to a board establishing pilotage areas
solely for the monetary benefit of its members.
Number 652
ART JACOBSEN, representing CROWLEY MARINE SERVICES, stated
his feelings that requiring state licensed pilots aboard
tugs with oil barges will not necessarily put a person with
extensive local knowledge on board. He said it would also
not ensure that a person familiar with tug and barge
handling is on board. He stated that Crowley Marine has
knowledgeable and qualified personnel on board at this time.
He mentioned the potential doubling of pilotage fees on the
Kuskokwim River this year to about $15,000.00 per round trip
to Bethel, and he felt certain this would add many thousands
of dollars to the price of fuel in Alaskan villages.
TAPE 93-12, SIDE B
Number 013
CHAIR FOSTER asked Captain Sumstad to begin his testimony
before the committee.
CAPTAIN SUMSTAD, representing the KUSKOKWIM PILOTS
ASSOCIATION, explained that the association had been formed
in 1991 and it wasn't formed in order to make more money.
He noted there were currently many more pilots in other
areas of the state making much more than they. He mentioned
that the Kuskokwim River had not been charted since 1910.
He provided the committee with an old map of the Kuskokwim.
Number 230
RAY GILLESPIE, representing several marine pilot
organizations, stated that the company attorneys asked him
to share their opinions with regard to federal preemption.
He referred to three opinions within the member's packets.
Under the doctrine of preemption, where Congress has
legislated on a particular subject which is in its
constitutional control, and has manifested its intention to
govern the subject area, the authority of the states is
necessarily excluded and any state legislation is void.
State laws concerning pilotage are regulations of commerce
and have been held to fall with a class of powers which may
be exercised by states until Congress sees fit to act
otherwise. Insofar as Congress has in fact interposed in
the area of pilotage, its authority is supreme and exclusive
and thus state laws which conflict with federal statutes are
void.
MR. GILLESPIE said the lawyers have examined coastwise trade
as opposed to foreign trade. Coastwise trade is domestic
port to domestic port. Currently, coastwise trade is
governed by federal licensing only. He referred to the
Department of Commerce position paper, which implies that
this legislation is "unique." Historically, he noted, these
federal licensing requirements have preempted this field,
and it has been widely recognized that the states do not
have the authority to require additional state licensing
pilotage requirements.
MR. GILLESPIE stated he did not agree with the previous
testimony regarding the EXXON Valdez, which compared the
barge's potential for catastrophe - the two were not even
related due to the magnitude of oil which spilled from the
EXXON Valdez. He said a vessel is required to have a
federal pilot if the vessel is underway, is not on the high
seas, is of a type subject to inspection and is "not on the
register." "Not on the register" is one operating on a
coastwise voyage and not coming from a foreign port. The
federal law also provides that a state may not impose on a
federal pilot an obligation to procure a state license or
adopt any other regulation that will impede a federal pilot
in the performance of the pilot's duties.
Number 072
BOB HERRON, LEGISLATIVE ASSISTANT TO REPRESENTATIVE LYMAN
HOFFMAN, testified against HB 243 on behalf of Rep. Hoffman.
He suggested that the issue needed further study on the
actual financial burden to the rural areas through increased
rates due to the new regulations. He felt the bill should
be referred to a subcommittee to enable further study on the
problems addressed in the committee, and he felt the
financial burden to the rural people should be assessed more
clearly.
Number 389
BRICE EDGMON, LEGISLATIVE ASSISTANT TO REPRESENTATIVE GEORGE
JACKO, testified against HB 243 on behalf of Representative
Jacko. He also expressed his Senator's concerns regarding
the financial burden on the people in the rural areas
through increased rates, and also suggested that the
legislation be referred to a subcommittee for further study
before any action is taken in the House Transportation
Committee.
Number 495
CHAIR FOSTER requested suggestions as to what the will of
the committee was for HB 243. He asked if it should be
passed out, put into subcommittee as proposed, or should it
be scheduled to come up in committee at a later date?
Number 515
REPRESENTATIVE DAVIS agreed with the subcommittee referral
option. He said he was concerned with the economic impact
due to increased rates.
Number 525
REPRESENTATIVE MENARD moved the committee substitute.
Number 538
The committee substitute for HB 243 was adopted and CHAIR
FOSTER referred the committee substitute to a subcommittee
consisting of Representative Mulder and Representative
Mackie.
Number 553
CHAIR FOSTER requested that Representatives Mulder and
Mackie submit their subcommittee recommendations regarding
HB 243 to the full committee approximately April 14.
HB 182 - APPROP: FAIRBANKS-NOME TRANS. CORRIDOR
HB 183 - TRANSPORTATION CORRIDOR: FAIRBANKS-NOME
Number 567
CHAIR FOSTER requested Representative James to come before
the House Transportation Committee and provide the committee
with an overview of her legislation, HB 182 and HB 183.
Number 570
REPRESENTATIVE JEANNETTE JAMES began her overview of the
legislation, saying that HB 182 and HB 183 were intended to
initiate preliminary and ultimately result in final action
necessary to properly review, identify and survey the best
options for establishment of a transportation/utility
corridor from the Interior's existing transportation hub to
the western area of the Seward Peninsula near Nome.
REPRESENTATIVE JAMES stated that the legislation directs the
Department of Transportation to perform aerial
reconnaissance, photography, interpretation and surveying.
She mentioned that the Department of Transportation supports
this work. The appropriation for this project is included
in HB 182 and will authorize the expenditure of funds
necessary to secure this important land use transportation
corridor as a step that will move the state forward to a
more positive economic future for a very large portion of
Alaska.
Number 587
CHAIR FOSTER referred to the proposed amendment to HB 183 to
delete the language contained in section (e).
DELETE on page 2, lines 30 through page 3, line 2:
(2) except for contracts necessary under (1) of this
subsection, may not contract for surveying, mapping,
and engineering and design services; the northern
region of the Department of Transportation and Public
Facilities shall perform all work using personnel
employed by that department.
Number 505
REPRESENTATIVE VEZEY questioned the intent of the entire
section (e) and requested the purpose of it being contained
in the legislation.
Number 595
REPRESENTATIVE JAMES responded that the language was
originally put in as a cost-saving measure and she would
have no problem with the language being removed since it has
been found that the department may be unable to handle this
project and it would be cheaper to contract out.
Number 645
CHAIR FOSTER asked Clyde Stoltzfus to come before the
committee regarding the deletion of the entire section (e).
MR. STOLTZFUS, CHIEF, OFFICE OF STRATEGIC MAGMT., PLANNING &
POLICY, DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION AND PUBLIC FACILITIES
(DOT/PF), replied that since the work would be cheaper by
contract, the department would not oppose the language.
Number 650
REPRESENTATIVE MULDER replied that if the DOT/PF had no
problems with the deletion of the section, and it could be
done more economically, the option for contracting out
should be available.
Number 659
REPRESENTATIVE MACKIE moved the proposed amendment to delete
entire subsection (e) from the original version of HB 183.
Number 669
CHAIR FOSTER noted there was no objection, thus the
amendment passed. He entertained a motion to moved HB 183
as amended from committee.
Number 671
REPRESENTATIVE MULDER moved that CSHB 183(TRA) be passed
from committee with individual recommendations.
TAPE 92-13, SIDE 1
Number 014
REPRESENTATIVE JAMES referred to the appropriated amount
included in HB 182, which was $7,300,300.
Number 026
REPRESENTATIVE MENARD referred to the large amount and
explained that the Finance Committee could address the
fiscal impact of HB 182.
Number 033
REPRESENTATIVE DAVIS entertained a motion to move out HB 182
with individual recommendation. Hearing no objections, HB
182 moved from committee with individual recommendations.
Number 043
CHAIR FOSTER adjourned the meeting at 6:50 p.m.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|